NUMBER OF LINES: 999 001=Usr:0 Null User 10/23/88 17:57 Msg:0 Call:0 Lines:19 1$If you are in need of help, you need but ask... 2$************************* 02 JUN 94 ************************************** 3$Welcome to BWMS II (BackWater Message System II) Mike Day System operator 4$************************************************************************** 5$GENERAL DISCLAIMER: BWMS II IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY INFORMATION 6$ PLACED ON THIS SYSTEM. 7$BWMS II was created as an electronic bill board. BWMS II is a privately 8$owned and operated system which is currently open for use by the general 9$public. No restrictions are placed on the use of the system. As the 10$system is privately owned, I retain the right to remove any and all 11$messages which I may find offensive. Because of the limited size of the 12$system, it will be periodically purged of messages (only 999 lines of data 13$can be saved). To leave a message, type 'ENTER'. Use ctrl/C to get out 14$the ENTER mode. The message is automatically stored. If after entering 15$the message you find you made a mistake, use the replace command to 16$replace the line. To exit from the system, type 'BYE' then hang up. 17$Type 'HELP' to see other commands that are available on the system. 18$************************************************************************** 19$ 002=Usr:1 CISTOP MIKEY 06/02/94 20:19 Msg:8139 Call:46944 Lines:2 20 In memory of Betty Jean Day 1927-1994 21 ******************************************************************** 003=Usr:34 Justin Klein 06/02/94 23:09 Msg:8140 Call:46945 Lines:9 22 ===========================Justin the Blue================================== 23 Betty Jean Day...your mother? 24 I've seen a few relatives of my own off this mortal coil. I was 25 at the death of my wife's grandmother. 26 Therefore, my condolences. May you find peace in bereavement and 27 comfort in the fact that you knew her when alive, a priviledge only 28 a few can really ever claim. 29 My heart goes out to you. 30 ============================================================================ 004=Usr:19 Null User 06/05/94 18:20 Msg:8141 Call:46959 Lines:15 31 >>>>>WOrld Watch Three>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 32 JI, Y'ALL! 33 Justin, I'm flattered you remember my earlier attempts at Network Zero, and 34 yes, I did us ascii faces to help tell who was talking. I do hope to 35 continue on with new adventures, however, I must admit the twenty minuets 36 into the future I go into is a bit darker than before..... 37 38 Now for a bit of reality, I've noticed a small glitch in the system. 39 It seems that all new useres are issued #019.....(Since my return, I've 40 had to re-aply twice since returning....) 41 42 I hope this isn't a serious problem.... 43 Bye fer now....... Be seeing you. 44 >>>>>Network Zero>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 45 li 31- 005=Usr:34 Justin Klein 06/05/94 23:30 Msg:8142 Call:46962 Lines:22 46 ==========================Justin the Blue=================================== 47 Phoenix (can I still refer to you as that now, since you now just 48 sign as "World Watch 3"), I can't wait to see how your new talk show 49 comes on. 50 Can I be a guest. I can be, like, one of those "dinosaurs". Or maybe 51 I'll detach body parts or something. Just so's I can be famous. I could 52 be the only person in the USA who hasn't attended a taping (as a guest 53 OR as a subject). 54 Heck, I just want to be famous, and it's been proven that your 15 min 55 of fame will go by slower if you're famous on a small, local BBS. I could 56 savor it. I can just picture it: you could ask me: "So, Justin, what 57 was it like back when you were on BW the first time, back in 1987, and 58 I could say: 59 B-) WELL, WE TALKED LIKE THIS, LOUDLY, BECAUSE WE HAD A ADM3A WITHOUT 60 LOWER CASE. IT WAS KIND OF LIKE HAVING TO SCREAM THROUGH ONE OF 61 THE FIRST TELEPHONES. AND WE DID IT AT 300 BAUD. YES, MODEMING TOO. 62 AND WE HAD TO WALK UPHILL TO SCHOOL. BOTH WAYS. 63 64 Good god, I'm getting a head rush from all this. 65 Take five. 66 ...Justin 67 ============================================================================ 006=Usr:219 Friar Mossback 06/07/94 09:23 Msg:8143 Call:46967 Lines:4 68 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] 69 Mike- 70 So sorry to hear of your loss. My condolences and sympathy. 71 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][ Friar [][][][][][][][][][] 007=Usr:758 Thesis Antithesi 06/07/94 17:30 Msg:8144 Call:46970 Lines:9 72 { 73 74 (The part of me that is still "Hagbard" mourns, in silence.) 75 76 } 77 | 78 79 My sympathies. 80 008=Usr:316 scott wirth 06/08/94 20:57 Msg:8145 Call:46979 Lines:7 81 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- 82 Phoenix: I will try to get ahold of you Sunday, but I cannot absolutely 83 guarantee that I will get to see you. I, unfortunately, must attend the 84 fiasco, and I'll try to get free as soon as possible after it is over. 85 Mike: my condolences... 86 Klapauscius 87 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- 009=Usr:54 George Freemont 06/15/94 17:03 Msg:8147 Call:47015 Lines:4 88 --------- 89 Does anyone know the local number for Compuserve. It's been a looong time 90 since I've logged on. Thx. George 91 --------- 010=Usr:379 Phoenix Polymorp 07/07/94 08:01 Msg:8148 Call:47110 Lines:1 92 On drums; The Pope! 011=Usr:84 Michael Miller j 07/12/94 15:25 Msg:8149 Call:47137 Lines:14 93@&*&*&*&*'s (Gee, don't remember how many of thosed to put.) 94 &*&*&*&*'s 95 96 Hello All. I'm still in the land downsouth. Even have a Cali 97 license now. I look like a corpse (In the license picture that 98 is.) 99 100 Hope everyone up there is doing well. Things down here are going 101 very well right now. Northern CA. has grown on me to the point 102 where I actually like it better then what portland is turning 103 into. Scary thought. 104 105 An Astral Dreamer 106 &*&*&*&*'s (Dreams come true) 012=Usr:84 Michael Miller j 08/04/94 16:27 Msg:8150 Call:47227 Lines:17 107 108 109 &*&*&*&*'s 110 Apparently bw is in a state of hybernation. 111 112 I was just looking over some of the old archives. Its kinda tou 113 dealing with just how annoying I was in the early days. I couldn't spell 114 And I was way obnoxious. Oh well, its tough to deal with seeing 115 a younger less experienced version of oneself. 116 117 Please excuse any mangling of the text I enter. I'm doing this 118 through several unix systems and on a keyboard that has a broke 119 return key. (Don't ask) 120 121 ater, 122 An Astral Dreamer 123 &*&*&*&*'ss (In the land of the computer giants.) 013=Usr:84 Michael Miller j 08/05/94 11:00 Msg:8151 Call:47230 Lines:23 124 125 &*&*&*&*'s 126 Me again. Fixed the keyboard. now all I have to contend with is the 127 lag caused by going from ISDN-T?->56kbit->14.4 Slip->2400. 128 129 Backwater has always been somewhat self referential. I have been around 130 for six years now. In a lot of ways I grew up on this board. I cut 131 my teath from 88 to 90, finally started making decent entries around 132 the end of 89 (Not to strangly this was after the death of my father. I did a 133 lot of growing up that year.) And then last year I moved away. I'd 134 stoped calling several months earlier. I guess I'd outgrown BWMSII. There 135 weren't many people calling, and almost nothing was going on. 136 137 Perhaps the board is just sleeping. Its still here, so there is always a 138 chance at new life. Since I have access to a local dialout this costs 139 me nothing, so I think I'll continue to call from time to time. Next 140 week I'll even be in portland. Hopefully my California plates won't get 141 me shot. :-) 142 143 (I dare you to make an entry!) 144 145 An Astral Dreamer 146 &*&*&*&*'s (Still dreaming after all these years) 014=Usr:92 Katherine Dohert 08/10/94 08:24 Msg:8152 Call:47243 Lines:4 147 ************************************************* 148 California? 149 ***** 150 ****************************kathyD**************** 015=Usr:129 Ket Larken 08/11/94 00:14 Msg:8154 Call:47250 Lines:33 151 :::::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::=====::::: 152 153 MIKEY: Greetings. Am using brother's account to post this. Please 154 destroy the old account 'Zephyr Rabbit', as I do not recall the 155 password - it's been 4 years or so. :) As you will note, I have 156 requested a new account. I'll post under that in the future. 157 158 KATHYD: *Bowing* I stand before you as one who knew you once. Last I 159 recall, you were about to embark on a voyage to the tropics or 160 some such. That should set the date for when we last spoke. How 161 have you fared in the time since? Have matters found you well? 162 I am taking care in my speech - it is disquieting, trying to say 163 hello to someone I felt reverence for as an 'old timer' while at 164 the same time realizing I've been off-and-on this board for about 165 a little over a decade myself - and am back after so long an absence. 166 Much to the chagrin of some who dwell here, I would imagine. 167 Backwater has ever been a little port of haven for me, a familiar 168 sort of curiosity. It'll take a bit to get used to scrolling again 169 and the like, but trust me - I'll manage to do myself proud, I hope. 170 I hope this message finds you well and that your thoughts are of 171 matters that are not troubling - as they seemed to be when we last 172 spoke, if I recall correctly. "I disremember..." 173 174 A.D. : Regards - the same as above. I tip a not-too-floppy ear in your 175 general direction. I feel a flood of passions - don't worry! :) 176 It's just the excitement, the feelings that come when a person has 177 been away longer than he should have - not accounting for those who 178 wished me good riddance. 179 180 Enough prattle and -more- than enough ambiguous alliteration. Howya' all 181 doin', gang? :) My pals. :) 182 183 :::::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::Zephyr:::::=====:::::=====:::::=====::::: 016=Usr:84 Michael Miller j 08/12/94 13:52 Msg:8155 Call:47255 Lines:34 184 &*&*&*&*'s 185 Zephyr, 186 Good to see you. I start a new job on Monday. Good money, and decent 187 long term prospects. I've been out of work these last three weeks, 188 as I got fired for being sick three days running. (The life of a contractor 189 in the computer biz ain't always a rosy one.) 190 191 This job is more like a real position. As an added bonus I'll be working 192 at the same place as several friends, one of them being Milchar (A backwater 193 semi oldtimer. Much older then me anyway.) I'm looking forward to it. 194 195 KathyD, 196 Yes California. The job prospects in Portland were nowhere near as good 197 198 as the ones down here in the Bay area. I've worked all but 6 weeks of 199 the last year, and will probably be working continuously for the 200 next several with the exception of holidays and vacation time. 201 202 203 Its nice in northern CA. I'm not sure if I'`ve mentioned this here before, 204 but I actually am starting to PREFER this area. Its a high tech junkies 205 paraise, and the pay is great. All sorts of cool things to see and do as well. 206 207 208 Plus most of the people I've known for more then a few years made the move 209 before me. I've still got friends in Oregon, but fewer and fewer are 210 there, while more and more are here. 211 212 I'll continue to login once a week or so. Best to everyone. 213 214 An Astral Dreamer 215 216 &*&*&*&*'s (Saying nice things about Cali. Where are teh aliens who took my 217 brain) 017=Usr:379 Phoenix Polymorp 08/13/94 00:42 Msg:8156 Call:47265 Lines:11 218 NetworkZero\WorldWatchThree\PHOENIX POLYMORPH 219 Greatingd, Astral Dreamer! Strange how it takes someone from out of 220 state to liven things up.... Glad to hear things are going well for you. 221 I, too, remember BWMS from long ago, phoning in on a TRaSh 80 at a zoomin' 222 300 baud. WE HAD TO SHOUT TO BE HEARD IN THOSE DAYS.... 223 224 Gods! My girlfriend is right! I *DO* talk like an old man! 225 226 All for now. 227 This is Phoenix Polymorph, Online and indirect..... 228 ^c 018=Usr:129 Ket Larken 08/13/94 23:03 Msg:8157 Call:47268 Lines:25 229 :::::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::======:::::=====:::::=====::::: 230 231 *Sigh* At present, job prospects elude me, as well. And let me reiterate the 232 pleasantries and say it is good to see -you-. Say 'hello' 233 to Milchar... I had the pleasure of meeting him when I was 12 years old. He 234 will remember me. 235 236 It feels good here, if quiet. But 'quiet' can have its own rewards - if a 237 place is quiet enough, you can hear someone whispering. Oooooo - Proverbs. :) 238 239 Just consider this our own private playground, or rather Mikey's private 240 playground that he lets us play in. It's not quite the 'Secret Garden', but 241 there's an energy that floods my spine when I dial up and get the connect that 242 no other currently existing board provides. 243 244 I miss the Inn. I've been to too many Inns not to miss one that had the flavor 245 of smoke and snow and crisp leaves whenever I called up, like incense on-line 246 (quick, someone get a patent!). I miss that feeling - but though I do not know 247 the 'why's or the 'whereabout's of the Inn's demise, I know it was probably for 248 the best - everything needs to change. 249 250 It's black as pitch outside, and black as pitch on the Telix screen. So much 251 for virtual reality. 252 253 :::::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::=====Zephyr=====:::::=====:::::=====::::: 019=Usr:84 Michael Miller j 08/15/94 08:10 Msg:8158 Call:47278 Lines:19 254 &*&*&*&*'s 255 Zephyr, 256 257 I'll mention you to Milch when I get a chance. 258 259 I don't know how the job situation has changed in the last year, but I can't 260 believe it could have gotten much better up there. To many people mooving 261 from out of state with lots of money and experiance.. 262 263 Today is my first day at my new job. Should be fun. Had to fill out a long 264 form,and I'm going to have to take a drug test soon as well. Life in the 90's 265 sucks in a lot of ways, but its the price you have to pay. 266 267 Well, I need to get going. Gotta make final preperations for work. Will 268 check in later in the week. 269 270 An Astral Dreamer 271 &*&*&*&*'s (I see the red moon rising) 272 020=Usr:129 Ket Larken 08/17/94 13:56 Msg:8159 Call:47293 Lines:9 273 ;;;;;=====:::::=====:::::+====:::::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::=====;:::: 274 275 Astral Dreamer: Let us know how it turns out - 'First Day' stories are the best 276 of all. :) 277 278 Mikey: I know you got rid of the Inn, but does that mean you object to having 279 stories posted here? 280 281 :::::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::Zephyr:::::=====:::::=====:::::=====::::: 021=Usr:84 Michael Miller j 08/22/94 08:04 Msg:8160 Call:47314 Lines:18 282 &*&*&*&*'s 283 First day was cool. I'm starting to get the hang of the place. Alas, 284 I got stuck being up til 3:30 am on friday, and I'm only just getting 285 286 ck into a reasonable sleep schedule. I seem to have way to many friends 287 who don't understand teh concept of being at work by 8:30. Mostly because 288 they don't have to be I guess. Its much better now that I don't have a 289 two hour per day commute, but it still gets annoying. (I'm currently 290 living in a living room, and everyone was over playing a game called 291 292 Magic the gathering. ) 293 294 295 Oh well, guess I'd better get to work. Yawn. (Doesn't help that I got 296 woke up at 11:30 last night by the phone. ) 297 298 An Astral Dreamer (Victom of weekend jet lag.) 299 &*&*&*&*'s 022=Usr:758 Thesis Antithesi 08/26/94 21:44 Msg:8161 Call:47339 Lines:26 300 | 301 302 True, AD, you are not missing much right now. In fact, it's a bit worse 303 than what you describe (at least for this side of town). Traffic on 217 304 is now a legitimate nightmare, as well as Sunset, et al. Most of the people 305 coming into town have mixed skills...and mixed money. The area is slowly 306 being drained of it's resources. Portland will slowly turn into South 307 California in 20-30 years; I firmly believe this, as long as people continue 308 to migrate to the area. Many years ago, when I first moved here, I thought 309 that Portland had a certain "magical" quality about it. That feeling has 310 slowly died over the last four years. 311 312 So what is North California like? I've only heard that it resembles 313 Oregon culture in some ways, but otherwise it's still quite different 314 and unique. 315 316 On the brighter side, it's good to hear that you are doing well. I 317 too miss the interaction of BW from a few years back; every few weeks, I 318 drop by to see what has happened, who has left or arrived or returned, 319 and to generally be a nosy person and eavesdrop on conversation. 320 321 | 322 323 Then again... 324 325 | 023=Usr:84 Michael Miller j 08/27/94 13:17 Msg:8162 Call:47341 Lines:31 326 &*&*&*&*'s 327 328 When I worked in Beaverton I was coming from SE. Generally I'd take 329 the Beaverton Hillsdale route, since tit was almost always faster 330 than 217. I can just imagine what it is like now that MAX is 331 going in. 332 333 Norther Cal. Is a lot like oregon. Atleast the Bay area is. People 334 here tend to be less than fond of their southern neighbors, you 335 can drive for half an hour to an hour and be in a fairly rural 336 setting, and the people are fairly cool overall. 337 338 The down side is the cost of living is a bit high, but if you can get 339 a job in the computer industry its easy to deal with. Generally its 340 not that hard to make something close to 2x what smaller companies 341 pay for computer types up there./ This is especially true of people 342 with any amount of Unix systems admin experience. 343 344 In another month or two I should be back on my feet financially, at 345 which point I'll be VERY happy. Lets just say I making a heck of a lot 346 more down here than I ever made in Portland. 347 348 349 Best of wishes to everyone. BTW, on the off chance anyone is interested 350 in my fiction writting you can find a number of pieces on ftp.netcom.com 351 in the /pub/fixion dir. Check out the INDEX file for a list of things 352 I wrote. Some of them have their origons in stuff I wrote on BWMS II 353 years ago. I can be reached via email aat mke@netcom.com. 354 355 An Astral Dreamer (I dream therfore I am.) 356 &*&*&*&*'s 024=Usr:379 Phoenix Polymorp 08/28/94 02:32 Msg:8163 Call:47346 Lines:1 357 025=Usr:137 David Clough 09/01/94 02:28 Msg:8164 Call:47363 Lines:28 358 :::::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::=====::::::=====::::: 359 360 *Sigh* Still everything quiet as a church mouse might be. Finally saw *The 361 Little Rascals* a week ago - I am a consummate Rascals fan. I'm not sure what 362 I think of their efforts to remake it. On the one hand, it was a noble try - 363 and they're true to the style. On the other hand, they're true to the style 364 primarily because they rip things off from just about every one of the classic 365 Our Gang comedies - and what they don't rip off is abysmally bad. And none of 366 it is really all that funny when done in color on a high budget. I think they 367 should have gone with making up their own tone, their own way of doing things. 368 As it stands, it's like trying to copy Monet with an Etcha-Sketch. You've got 369 to admire the tenacity, but it's a losing and foolish proposition from the 370 start. 371 372 However, I -will- be buying the soundtrack if they include Bug Hall singing 373 "You Are So Beauuu-TEE-Full" as Alfalfa. Not to mention the other songs he 374 does. 375 376 And before anyone says anything - hey, I'm the one who bought the soundtrack 377 for *North* so I could use the sample of Elijah Wood singing *Fiddler on the 378 Roof* "If I Were a Wealthy Man, Hey!" :) 379 380 Enough silliness - on with the silence that has been the norm for this board 381 for far too long. 382 383 MIKEY: Thanks for the validation. It lets me know I'm worthwhile. :) 384 385 ;;;;;=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::Zephyr:::::=====:::::=====:::::=====::::: 026=Usr:84 Michael Miller j 09/06/94 14:31 Msg:8165 Call:47391 Lines:13 386 &*&*&*&*'s 387 Well, I'm back for another e-visit. Hope everyone had a good weekend. Mine 388 was mostly boring, but picked up at the end. I might finally be entering a 389 stage in my life that Ia few years ago I didn't think was possible. More 390 as things develope. Lets just say in general that its a very good thing. 391 392 I haven't seen the rascals, but I did recently see Corina Corina. Its 393 fairly good, though all the anachronisms really got annoying at times. 394 395 Later all 396 397 An Astral Dreamer 398 &*&*&*&*'s (Finding my way home) 027=Usr:84 Michael Miller j 09/07/94 17:48 Msg:8166 Call:47396 Lines:13 399 &*&*&*&*'s 400 401 Hello All, 402 I'm finally dating. And while I can't at this point say I'm in love 403 with her, I'm definetly in extreme like. 404 405 406 Maybe good things do come to those who wait. Now I'm just hoping that it 407 works out. Guess I'll have to take my chances just like everybody else. 408 409 410 An Astral Dreamer 411 &*&*&*&*'s (Where I feared I'd never be.) 028=Usr:186 Wesley Smith 09/07/94 20:32 Msg:8167 Call:47398 Lines:12 412 Hi I know what you mean about love, I don't think it will ever come my way. i 413 am #43 years old and can't seme to find a lasting relationship. I keep on look 414 ing for love. Mabee it will come if i am just a little more patient. oh well 415 i think i will change the subject. I am a ham radio operator and have really 416 bean enjoying my privilages as a general class lisenced ham. I really enjoyed 417 field day this year, it was at Oral hull park for the blind, just out side 418 sandy, Or. It was my first field day. We are having another week ender out at 419 the park this week end. It is called polanesian magic, it has an island feel 420 to it. It is on September the #10, and #11. It is open to all blind and 421 visualy impared people and there friends, for more information call 668-6195. 422 from Wesley Smith. Ka7-edb. by for now i like this board allot, I call often 423 just to read the stuff on the bbs. Well better go for now so 73's for now, 029=Usr:84 Michael Miller j 09/10/94 14:46 Msg:8168 Call:47413 Lines:13 424 &*&*&*&*'s 425 426 One of the things I've gotten better at over time is dealing with what 427 life throws my way. I used to be depressed and unhappy all the time 428 because I thought I didn't deserve to be happyy, that I was worthless 429 and a waste of space. And with that attitude I wasn't far off from 430 being right. 431 432 I remember hearing people say that you have to love yourself before 433 you can love somebody else, and that really seems to be true. 434 435 An Astral Dreamer 436 &*&*&*&*'s (Trying not to be a sponge.) 030=Usr:84 Michael Miller j 09/13/94 21:41 Msg:8169 Call:47428 Lines:9 437 438 Life like the river flows by my door 439 In the evenining I watch it 440 441 Morase of images 442 New lease on life 443 444 Frown, but smile 445 031=Usr:186 Wesley Smith 09/15/94 18:18 Msg:8170 Call:47432 Lines:5 446 from Wesley Smith, I really enjoyed the weekender at the park. It was alot o 447 fun. We had a hulah contest and a midnight swim, also a stir fry dinner on 448 Saturday night, a verry good breakfast on Sunday and a so-so lunch. I am 449 looking foreword to the next weekend on October #1 and #2. It will be a German 450 weekend. I hope to see some new faces, and hear new voices there. Well better 032=Usr:84 Michael Miller j 09/20/94 11:43 Msg:8171 Call:47449 Lines:4 451 452 D lurk 453 454 033=Usr:219 Friar Mossback 09/23/94 15:08 Msg:8172 Call:47464 Lines:4 455 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] 456 The inn can never die. It exists in an unreal place. 457 [][][][][][][][][][][][] Friar [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] 458 034=Usr:186 Wesley Smith 10/07/94 20:01 Msg:8173 Call:47499 Lines:3 459 From We\s Smith, Well the german weekender was just as good as i had hoped. 460 we all had a very good time listening to polkas and other C. D.s. I would like 461 to encourage others with visual imparments to try the park for a weekend. It 035=Usr:84 Michael Miller j 10/12/94 13:53 Msg:8175 Call:47518 Lines:28 462 &*&*&*'s 463 Rolling, Rolling, Rolling. Got to Keep it Rolling... 464 465 Life is aa peril, but death is no friend 466 to the young or unhappy 467 468 Come not to me crying 469 Don't talk of the end 470 You can't be done living 471 When you haven't begun. 472 473 The world is around us 474 It shelters and kills 475 And we live upon it 476 So hurry up run 477 478 There is to much happening 479 To little we work 480 at the here and teh now 481 and the also to come 482 483 Live not in the past 484 though remember its lessons 485 Forget not the future 486 And your place in it 487 488 An Astral Dreamer 489 &*&*&*&*'s (Long Distance Run around.) 036=Usr:758 Thesis Antithesi 10/13/94 17:27 Msg:8176 Call:47521 Lines:9 490 | 491 492 Love tends to sit around on a bench, watching you flounder with 493 blinders on, until it becomes tired of the specticle and whacks you on 494 the head, knocking the blinders off. 495 496 At least, that's been my experience. Not much to talk about, really. 497 498 | 037=Usr:186 Wesley Smith 10/13/94 18:43 Msg:8177 Call:47522 Lines:6 499 From Wes Smith, I heard a new show on ham radio on KBNP. It comes on Sundays 500 from 3:00 Pm. to 4:00 Pm.. It"s called Ham radio and more, it"s a talk show, 501 from Arizona. It is very good. The frequency is #1410. M. Hz. on Am. Try it 502 you"ll like it. 503 504 038=Usr:4 Milchar 10/19/94 16:48 Msg:8178 Call:47549 Lines:1 505 +++++++++++++++ Milchlurk.... Hi Zeph! +++++++++++++++ Live from CA ++++++++++ 039=Usr:84 Michael Miller j 10/26/94 13:04 Msg:8179 Call:47573 Lines:6 506 507 Some state other than mine 508 No state out of time 509 This state is mine 510 Out of Time 511 040=Usr:379 Phoenix Polymorp 10/26/94 16:42 Msg:8180 Call:47574 Lines:2 512 Phoenix Lurk 513 ^c 041=Usr:379 Phoenix Polymorp 11/03/94 01:40 Msg:8182 Call:47601 Lines:15 514 picture 515 516 i wish i knew where you are tonight 517 i wish i knew how you are tonight 518 i wish i could hold you close again 519 and sing the song we share 520 many miles we've travled 521 many lives we've lived 522 our differences were our strengths 523 similarities our joy 524 525 i wish i knew where you were 526 527 phoenix 528 ^C 042=Usr:167 HUGH FARRELL 11/07/94 22:33 Msg:8183 Call:47622 Lines:7 529@-=*=- -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- 530@he was curled on hege air about her. Her eyes were distant w hung in her mind: 531@She glanced at her litter of kittens. One slept, one trailed a bit of ribbon f 532@Approaching the edge of the trees, she hesitated, as is the way of cats. Her e 533@The breeze then shifted, bringing a whiff of dust from the stables. Was that d 534@The Backwater Inn appeared deserted! Ah, well, it was not opening time yet. S 535@=*=- -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- d -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- 043=Usr:167 HUGH FARRELL 11/11/94 16:20 Msg:8188 Call:47630 Lines:30 536 -=*=- -=*=- 11/11/94 537 She was curled on her home hearth when she woke with a strange 538 air about her. Her eyes were distant with memories, perhaps 539 with dreams? An image hung in her mind: of shimmering wings, 540 pearly length and one eye in a slender face, full of curiosity 541 and humour. An invitation, unanswered these many years past, to 542 fly with Pegasus...her siren call. 543@-=*=- -=*=- d -=*=- -=*=- 544 She glanced at her litter of kittens. One slept, one trailed a 545 bit of ribbon for amusement, another was off adventuring. She 546 didn't hear any call, no one asked her whereabouts, so at this 547 moment the cat Denise ventured forth, sure of her destination, 548 unsure of her welcome. 549 550 Approaching the edge of the trees, she hesitated, as is the way 551 of cats. Her eyes went first to the rowan twig. Nay, a tree! 552 It was a sorry sentinel now to remember Pam by! Looking closer, 553 she saw that it was yet alive from the clean, coursing waters. 554 She purred with approval, remembering that gentle voice. 555 556 The breeze then shifted, bringing a whiff of dust from the stables. 557 Was that dim flicker a candle? She kept an ear attuned to it 558 as she focused on the great Inn. 559 560 The Backwater Inn appeared deserted! Ah, well, it was not 561 opening time yet. Surely an Inn that had withstood so many 562 changes over eleven years could not close! Composedly, she 563 sat down to wait. Only if someone stepped near could they 564 see the fire of anticipation in her eyes. 565 -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- d -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- 044=Usr:26 Mohammed Wassir 11/13/94 13:45 Msg:8189 Call:47642 Lines:9 566 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 567 Ah, d, nice to see you again. Some of us lurk behind the oaks, 568 remembering the epic past, and waiting patiently for old friends 569 to return to this rustic place. Hail and well met. 570 571 Mohammed Wassir 572 573 574 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 045=Usr:379 Phoenix Polymorp 11/14/94 02:40 Msg:8190 Call:47647 Lines:12 575 NETWORKZERO\WORLDWATCHTHREE\PHOENIX.POLYMORPH>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 576 Epic past? Did someone mention 'Epic Past'? Like, de ja vu! 577 I found a tape this evening, one I made some seven or eight years ago, back 578 when I was a regular here. I looked back on those days with more than a little 579 lamentation. While listenning to a couple of Japan songs I started cataloging 580 What all I had lost in that time (includding the Japan CDs...), and what little 581 I have gained. As I stand here in the valley of my dispare, looking up at the 582 peeks of my joy, I wonder if I still have it in me to climb back up. 583 584 I'll fill you in when I'm in a better mood..... 585 ^c 586 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 046=Usr:397 dragon lady 11/14/94 03:43 Msg:8191 Call:47648 Lines:14 587 -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- 11/13/94 588 She padded quietly towards the bridge, her eyes jet and green against 589 her moonlit fur. One man stood with a dejected back in this time 590 portal, but the first turned slightly and smiled. She recognized his 591 jerkin and purred a welcome with appropriate respect for the circlet 592 of gold just visible on his forehead. 593 594 All three faced the Inn expectantly. Did it seem just a bit less 595 shabby? Was that stirring inside the Cistop, awakening to an earlier 596 decade with surprise? Her paws kneaded the mossy bank, and she half 597 closed her eyes, remembering the strains of the piper, the savoury 598 scents of roast meat and cider that always drifted with the friar, 599 and the hearty laughter of the barefoot captain, his hat tilted jauntily. 600 -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- d -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- -=*=- 047=Usr:758 Thesis Antithesi 11/15/94 21:41 Msg:8193 Call:47661 Lines:9 601 602 Exhale. 603 604 I had regained most of my former self. 605 606 Something new was grafted to me, a part of my identity. 607 608 No matter. My identity had no set form, either. 609 048=Usr:379 Phoenix Polymorp 11/16/94 02:26 Msg:8194 Call:47662 Lines:13 610 How many times will they turn against you? 611 How many times will you walk away? 612 How many times will you let depression win the fight? 613 Oh, my sentimental friend we'll walk as one again. 614 one small day.... 615 616 I don't know why but that song has been stuck in my mind most of the night 617 I guess it reflects my mood.... 618 619 But why, after all these years, am I wondering how things might be 620 different had I shaved off my beard and quit smoking..... 621 Phoenix 622 ^C 049=Usr:167 HUGH FARRELL 11/16/94 19:48 Msg:8196 Call:47669 Lines:35 623 ========================================================================= 624 Now, I'm going to throw down the gauntlet to you atheists! Have you 625 ever considered the history, the roots of atheism? 626 627 "We live on a crisis-filled planet; a momentary glance at newspaper 628 headlines confirms that fact each day. The desperate state of our 629 world has caused many to question the existence of God. Some, claiming 630 to be atheist, even deny his existence. Is that true of you? 631 632 Belief or disbelief in God can profoundly affect your outlook on the 633 future. Without God, the survival of the human race is entirely in 634 man's hands--a bleak thought, considering man's destructive potential. 635 If you do believe that God exists, then you likely accept that life 636 on this planet does have a purpose--a purpose that may yet be realized. 637 638 Although denials of God's existence have been sporadic throughout history, 639 it is only in recent centuries that the popularity of atheism has spread. 640 641 Do you know why?" 642 643 ""The Churches were the soil of atheism," writes theology professor 644 Michael J. Buckley. "The Western conscience found itself deeply 645 scandalized and disgusted by confessional religions. The Churches 646 and the sects had devastated Europe, engineered massacres, demanded 647 religious resistance or revolution, attempted to excommunicate or 648 to depose monarchs."" w94 12/1/94 pp 3,4 649 650 So, M. Wassir, Katherine, Michael, Phoenix, Cistop, Milchar and 651 Antithesis, what do you say? Do you agree that mainstream religion 652 has trampled on people's consciences until many felt driven to 653 turn their back on God, too? Is there a compelling reason to 654 reconsider the issue of God's existence? 655 656 * Denise Amos * 11/16/94 * 657 ========================================================================= 050=Usr:379 Phoenix Polymorp 11/17/94 13:17 Msg:8197 Call:47674 Lines:24 658 >Network Zero>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>World Watch Three 659 First, I should like to ask if I was invited to join this discussion 660 under the assumption that I am an atheist? I am not. I do, however, 661 hold no affection for most religions, but do not deny the exsistance 662 of any god (Christian, Wiccan, Paggan or other). 663 664 This causses me to also ask what is your deffinition of "atheist"? 665 One can deny the exsistance of the Christian god and be a devout follower 666 of Odin (PLEASE don't tell me they are merly worshiping Jahova under a 667 different name....). Would that make them an atheist? By my understanding 668 'atheism' means 'no theistic beliefs', and, since the belief in old Norse 669 gods IS a theistic belief, then I must argue that an Odanist is not an 670 atheist. 671 672 As far as religion causing people to turn there back on, what I assume 673 you mean the Christian god, God? In my case, no. It has, however 674 caused me to turn my back on organised religion. 675 676 Just rambelling on.... 677 678 This has been Phoenix Polymorph coming to you electronically recorded. 679 Next on the Phoenix Polymorph Show: An Atheist's view. 680 >Network Zero>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>World Watch Three> 681 ^C 051=Usr:167 HUGH FARRELL 11/18/94 08:05 Msg:8199 Call:47683 Lines:29 682 ==================================================================== 683 Beautiful! It is the corruption of the religions of Christendom that 684 deserve to be spurned, rather than God. Bravo, Phoenix! 685 686 You have a good point about Odin-worshippers, so a definition is in order. 687 Atheism has taken on a new face, that of denying the *authority* of the 688 Almighty Jehovah. From my experience at Backwater, many may feel this way: 689 690 "Though it provoked much debate during the 19th century, the denial of 691 God's existence is neither shocking nor disturbing today... 692 Not that most people deny God outright; on the contrary, poll results 693 from 11 countries throughout the Americas, Europe, and Asia reveal that, 694 on the average, little more than 2 percent claim to be atheists. 695 Nevertheless, an atheistic spirit is prevalent--even among many who 696 believe that God exists. How can this be? 697 698 "Sometimes atheism refers simply to the practical rejection or 699 ignoring of God," notes The Encyclopedia Americana. For this reason, 700 The New Shorter Oxford English Dictionary gives the following second 701 definition of "atheist": "A person who denies God morally; 702 a godless person." 703 704 Yes, atheism may entail a denial either of God's existence or of 705 his authority or of both. The Bible alludes to this atheistic spirit 706 at Titus 1:16: "They profess to acknowledge God, but deny him by 707 their actions."--The New English Bible." w94 12/1/94 p5 708 709 For example, a typical attitude shown by Backwater patrons is this: 710 "People are resigned to the absence of God and are organizing their 052=Usr:167 HUGH FARRELL 11/18/94 08:21 Msg:8200 Call:47684 Lines:5 711 lives independently, for good or for ill, and without any reference 712 to God."--One Hundred Years of Debate Over God--The Sources of Modern Atheism 713 How do individuals deny God *morally*, would you say? What does it mean? 714 * Denise * 11/18/94 * 715 =========================================================================== 053=Usr:26 Mohammed Wassir 11/22/94 18:20 Msg:8203 Call:47707 Lines:21 716 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 717 Guess I was an athiest for a long time . . . the more exact term would be 718 an existentialist. I became one somewhere around the age of 12, back when 719 I thought Camus and Sartre were a Parisian comedy team. I really didn't 720 change until the past couple of years when I started an intense period of 721 personal growth spurred by trying to recover from growing up in an 722 alcoholic family. Now, I'm working on trying to become a spiritual person. 723 I'm not sure where that will lead me. I do believe there is some 724 organizing force in the Universe, but I still haven't figured out it that 725 meshes with the traditional concept of 'God'. 726 727 As for the decline of religion in contemporary culture, I think that has 728 a lot to do with the loss of traditional values and the breakup of the 729 nuclear family. Many of the values that were cherished in days of old 730 aren't relevant in the modern age. Of course, people like Jesse Helms 731 taking pot shots at everyone who don't agree with them doesn't help, 732 Kinda turns people off to religion. 733 734 Mohammed Wassir 735 >>>>>>NW0 834 ^C 057=Usr:316 scott wirth 11/27/94 19:31 Msg:8211 Call:47756 Lines:41 835 ((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((( 836 Just my two cents worth................. 837 838 I have my problems with many religions because of the manner in which they 839 try to "maintain" their flocks. Having been involved in a few religions, 840 I have become rather cynical as to the societal value of religion. The 841 main problem I find is that once a person is involved in a religion, 842 especially for a long period of time, there is a mindset involved with it. 843 Many times I find that the person has a "holier than thou" attitude, or they 844 act as if they know that a spot in heaven is reserved for them. 845 My other problem is the fact that the religions feel it necessary to 846 determine the more personal aspects of a persons life. The manner in which 847 they are intimate with their partner, is a good example. I actually have 848 personal experience with this. Rather than using her own feelings about it, 849 or coming to a decision about it based on her own feelings, she decided she 850 would rather know how the church felt about it, and actually call her mother 851 to ask what the church policy was on the particular form of intimacy. 852 I feel that a person who has been involved in a religion for a long time 853 in a way surrenders their will and freedom of choice to the decisions of those 854 who by all rights, should have no say in a persons personal life. My wife grew 855 up in the Mormon church. I sent her up here about six months before I got out 856 of the Navy, in order for her to save money for us by moving in with her mother 857 . Well, as soon as the Bishop of the local ward (who had been helping support 858 my mother in law, due to her being clinically depressed) found out that my wife 859 was moving in with her mother, withdrew all support from my mother-in-law. 860 Speaking with him, he felt that the family had not done enough to help her, and 861 withdrew support in the hope that she would commence to at least try and 862 support herself. I was not consulted in any way about the entire situation. 863 He felt he could interfere in my family's finances without speaking to me, and 864 my wife went ahead and let him. I came home to find all of $100 in the bank 865 after six months, and this guy wants me to tithe ten percent of my gross income 866 , when they build temples for millions of dollars, and can't help the people? 867 Give me a break! As Lazarus Long once said: 868 "Religion is a great job, if you have the stomach for it." 869 Religion is full of hypocrisy and "do as I say, not as I do" , which is why 870 I have never had a very high opinion of organized religion. 871 Just my personal opinion..... Klapauscius 872 I believe that Nietzsche was correct, we are long past the societal need for 873 religion. 874 875 ))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))Klapauscius))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) 058=Usr:379 Phoenix Polymorp 12/02/94 03:45 Msg:8215 Call:47780 Lines:1 876 Phoenix lurk...... ^C 059=Usr:167 HUGH FARRELL 12/04/94 00:54 Msg:8216 Call:47800 Lines:27 877 ======================================================================== 878 Klapauscius, I've been giving some thought to your reply. You certainly 879 have a legitimate grievance on the interference with your financial and 880 marital problems! Those are *both* very sensitive areas for other people 881 to give advice on, and it is not the church's business to be dictating, 882 certainly! Its your conclusion that I'm concerned about. Does the 883 existence--or even the prevalence--of false religion prove that there is 884 no true worship? 885 886 I'd like to illustrate the contrast by taking you back in time to Jesus' 887 time on earth, and contrast *his* teachings with the religious status quo, 888 which included an influential sect of Judaism, the Pharisees. You mentioned 889 strict tithing and self-righteous attitudes being a turn-off. 890 So did Jesus! His disciple relates in Luke 18:9-14 the following: 891 "But he spoke this illustration also to some who trusted in themselves 892 that they were righteous and who considered the rest as nothing: 893 "Two men went up into the temple to pray, the one a Pharisee and the 894 other a tax collector. The Pharisee stood and began to pray these things 895 to himself, 'O God, I thank you I am not as the rest of men, extortioners, 896 unrighteous, adulterers, or even as this tax collector. I fast twice a 897 week, I give the tenth of all things I acquire.' 898 But the tax collector standing at a distance was not willing even to raise 899 his eyes heavenward, but kept beating his breast, saying, 'O God, be 900 gracious to me a sinner.' I tell YOU, This man went down to his home 901 proved more righteous than that man; because everyone that exalts himself 902 will be humiliated, but he that humbles himself will be exalted."" 903 060=Usr:167 HUGH FARRELL 12/04/94 01:52 Msg:8217 Call:47801 Lines:36 904 But they were in a far more serious position than just being prideful. 905 906 "Hypocritical religious leaders showed they were actually in opposition 907 to God's sovereignty and will. (Matthew 23:13,27,38)...Jesus thoroughly 908 defeated them in a series of verbal encounters. He wielded "the sword of 909 the spirit," God's Word, with strength, perfect control, and strategy-- 910 cutting through subtle arguments and traplike questions that his opposers 911 advanced...(Matt. 21:23-27; 22:15-46) He fearlessly exposed them for 912 what they were: teachers of human traditions and formalisms, blind leaders, 913 a generation of vipers...(Matt. 15:12-14; 21:33-41,45; 23:33-35) it-2 p.69 914 915 "The Pharisees were so biased in their application of the Law that they 916 made it burdensome for the people, insisting that it be observed according 917 to their concepts and traditions." it-2 page 625 918 919 Matthew 23:4 illustrates how they 'maintain their flocks' as you put it: 920 "They bind up heavy loads and put them upon the shoulders of men, but 921 they themselves are not willing to budge them with their finger." Was 922 Jesus the same way? Was he hypercritical, arrogant or demanding? 923 924 "Jesus was also a man of great feeling...(Luke 18:9-14) He did not use 925 his authority to be demanding and to add to the people's burdens but, 926 rather, said: "Come to me, all you who are toiling...I will refresh you." 927 His disciples found him "mild-tempered and lowly in heart," his yoke 928 kindly and his load light.--Matthew 11:28-30" it-2 page 69 929 930 What did Jesus emphasize as being important in worship? Matthew 23:23 931 issues a scalding warning that comes through just as strong today: 932 933 "Woe to YOU, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because YOU give the 934 tenth of the mint and the dill and the cumin, but YOU have disregarded 935 the weightier matters of the Law, namely, justice and mercy and faithfullness. 936 These things it was binding to do, yet not to disregard the other things." 937 938 * Denise * 12/04/94 * 939 ============================================================================ 061=Usr:758 Thesis Antithesi 12/04/94 21:59 Msg:8218 Call:47806 Lines:52 940 | 941 942 I don't think much about such matters, but what I have thought, 943 points towards an unfortunate trend in the American religous community. 944 The formation and acceptance of the "Fundamentalist" Christians is 945 rotting the religous community from the inside out. I cannot accept the 946 following premises: 947 948 1) That God loves you. 949 2) That God will place you in a state of enternal torment, if you 950 fail to love him. 951 3) That living a "righteous" life alone will not be enough to avoid 952 the torment; you must unconditionally love and accept God to 953 avoid such punishment. 954 4) Once you have accepted the conditions above, you are enternally 955 saved from the punishment. 956 957 (Note: this refers to the concept of God as given by Christian Fundies) 958 959 I know that this is a rather shallow presentation of a proof, 960@I thinkx 961 and is quite generalized as well, but I think the general concept 962 is conveyed. 963 964 I am that which is despised and loathed by all sides. I am 965 agnostic. I believe that there are higher levels of existence, but 966 I need to see proof before I fully accept that concept in my life. 967 968 Before everyone runs off and grabs their baseball bats and starts 969 jumping up and down about logical proofs and whatnot, please understand 970 that I am limited by what I sense; I need to see, hear, smell, feel, 971 and taste that which is higher. Of course, this might not be 972 possible. 973 974 An interesting side note: if you ever get a chance to study 975 authentic Togakure Ryu Ninjutsu, from what little I've read, you 976 would need to have a frame of mind that entails searching for 977 religious experiences. Theistic ninjas? Who knows? Who cares? :) 978 But it's interesting that an art that was used for rebellion and 979 survival could be used in such a manner. 980 981 Well, enough of my rambling. My one cent is on the table. Don't 982 expect miracles from me. (Ok, really bad pun, but I'll be 983@ 984 good...I promise.) 985 986 | 987 988 I am not the Devil's Advocate. How can I be? I've already evicted 989 him for not paying the rent. 990 991 | 062=Usr:26 Mohammed Wassir 12/06/94 17:30 Msg:8221 Call:47816 Lines:6 992 ?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_? 993 Bummer, man. The first time I've felt like writing some 994 prose here in a long time, and there's barely room left 995 on the disk. Oh well, it'll wait. 996 ?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_?_? 997 Frankenstupe?_?_?_?_?_?_ etc. 063=Usr:379 Phoenix Polymorp 12/14/94 02:11 Msg:8231 Call:47862 Lines:2 998 Ok! I get the last word!!!!!! 999 Phoenix lurk ^C